Move Axle Back?

[jonesnforcampin]

Hey All,
To start off, I had no idea where the best place to put this was.... so here it is, General Discussion.
So our camper is not 100% done, but it was done enough to take it to our four day family reunion camping trip. It was fantastic and worked out great!!!!

Except for one thing... I am not sure if I am going to be able to get enough tongue weight to get it to tow properly. On the trip it towed ok, but there was some swaying, fishtailing going on at the back end. It wasn't bad at 75-80, but when we were going 80 and got to the top of a hill we got hit by wind and it swayed side to side quite a bit more. It was not to the point of losing control, just not a good idea to leave it as is.
Here is what we are looking at.
-The trailer is the 5x8 Northern Tool
-The camper is 5x10x4 + the tongue box
-We don't have the galley done so there was not much weight in back
-I put tools and some gas in the tongue box that will in the future hold two 6v golf cart batteries and tools
-The back end of the camper hangs over the back of the trailer 18 inches, the overhang is all galley
-The front hangs over 6 inches plus the 12 inch deep tongue box

So, I am thinking to get more tongue weight to move the axle back. I am thinking 12 inches, but then I don't want to move it back too far so wondering if 6 inches is sufficient. I don't want to go poking all kinds of holes in the trailer by moving it too far or not enough then having to do it again.

Then, I am not sure if I should even do it now. We have not weighed it yet so I don't know the exact numbers. I already took the camper off the trailer (it is removable) and flipped the trailer over, but now I am thinking we should put the camper back on the trailer, finish the galley and install the batteries. Then, take it down and weigh it and THEN decide on moving the axle. We are not planning on putting a fridge, microwave or an installed water tank in the galley. We plan on using ice chests and water jugs that we can move around to adjust tongue weight.

Do I even need to move the axle or just plan on the batteries, tools box, ice chests and water being sufficient? But then on the way home the water and ice chests will be lighter...

We had the idea of using 6in PVC pipe in 4ft lengths to hold water that would be attached to the underside of the trailer. But, then again if I install that in the front for more tongue weight it would give less tongue weight on the way home. I guess install them near the axle, one in front and one behind?

[halfdome, Danny]

Since your trailer is basically a rectangle box I'd go with the 60%/40% rule and put the axle 60% from the front/40% from the rear, or some where near that.
We aren't allowed to pull a trailer 80 mph on the West coast.
Danny

[les45]

My Super Bee weekender is built on the NT 5X8 trailer with a 5X10 shell hanging out one foot on each end. I did not change the axle location. I estimated my total loaded weight at 1,400 lbs with a tongue weight of 160 lbs. I had a single deep cycle battery on the tongue. I loaded my ice chests in the galley but I put all my camping gear on the bed as far forward as I could get it. That included an EZ Up, chairs, table, luggage, etc. I had no problems towing but I never had it to 80.

[bobhenry]

I gotta hang with Danny "60% of the box forward of the axle" ( it appears you are 50% 50% ) If you want to stay at 80+MPG go 70% / 30% for stability. Loaded weight is not the issue it is geometry. It is often easier to lengthen the tongue as it essentially moves the wheel back, but make sure you have the strength built into it. A bike platform in the front for toys or coolers is always a welcome option.

[Redneck Teepee]

What Danny and Bob Henry said, 60/40 is a standard minimum unless you have a special application that requires more axle set back.

[S. Heisley]

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This will probably help you the most: http://tnttt.com/Design_Library/Trailer ... %20101.htm

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I just re-read your post and noticed that you talked about using PVC for water. Industry standards are to use CPVC for drinking water as it is better for your health. It just depends upon how you're going to use that water.

Also, you might be able to simply put in one long line of water pipe if you put it front to back. This assumes that you have enough room between the chassis frame and the axle. The issue with a front to back water storage pipe is the angle that your trailer is at when it is hitched to your tow vehicle. If the hitch is low, the water (and weight) will flow forward. If the hitch is high, the water will flow to the back. The advantage to that is when you are unhitched, you can raise the front jack so that the water flows to the back, where your galley will be, which gives you good water pressure at the outlet and allows you to use every drop. It would be harder to get this advantage if you install the pipe side to side. Especially if you are parked on an uneven surface or hillside. Of course, when you're going up and down hills, this could also be a disadvantage; so, putting the line(s) a bit on the diagonal might help give you the best of both worlds. ...Just a few thoughts. Oh, and yes, putting water storage near the axle almost always works okay.

[Vedette]

Yes, just looking at the picture .......your axle is too far forward.
We tow fast all of the time (no problem to be over 100 mph comfortably), but I am a strong believer in "Torsion Ride Axles!
When we got home from our last trip (last night) we have just gone over the 41,000 miles of trouble free towing with "Miss Piggy"!
Good Roads
Brian & Sandi

[jonesnforcampin]

Ok, so looks like the consensus is the 60/40 ratio for axle placement. Sounds good.

I saw some others suggesting adding some length to the tongue or mounting a platform on the tongue. While those are not bad ideas, moving the axle back will be the easiest as it is all bolted so i dont have to get anything welded. Additionally, we really lucked out because the back hatch of our TV BARELY clears the current tongue box. As a matter of fact if we try to open it when the TV and camper are not perfectly straight there is not enough room.

Regarding the water storage in pipes, yeah hadnt figured it all out yet. Im thinking if we do try it then i will want to make them removable so i can drop one end a bit to get the water out. Additionally, going side to side we can stay in the void of the trailer between the side to side crossmembers. Front to back it would end up hanging down. That whole thing is just some ideas right now.

[halfdome, Danny]

We tow fast all of the time (no problem to be over 100 mph comfortably), but I am a strong believer in "Torsion Ride Axles!

Good Roads
Brian & Sandi

Are you talking miles per hour (MPH) or kilometers per hour (KPH) ???

Speed Limits in Canada

If you are an American and see a speed limit of “100” while travelling in Canada, that doesn’t mean you can go 100 miles/hour. This means 100 kilometres/hour and translates to just a bit more than 60 mph. In general, you can convert from kph to mph by dividing the speed in kph by 1.6.

40 kph = 25 mph
50 kph = 31 mph
60 kph = 37 mph,mv
80 kph = 50 mph
100 kph = 62 mph

120 kilometers per hour is the fastest you can go on a Canadian highway.

[S. Heisley]

Regarding the water storage in pipes, yeah hadnt figured it all out yet. Im thinking if we do try it then i will want to make them removable so i can drop one end a bit to get the water out. Additionally, going side to side we can stay in the void of the trailer between the side to side crossmembers. Front to back it would end up hanging down. That whole thing is just some ideas right now.

Good idea!

[jhorton3]

Ok, so looks like the consensus is the 60/40 ratio for axle placement. Sounds good.

I saw some others suggesting adding some length to the tongue or mounting a platform on the tongue. While those are not bad ideas, moving the axle back will be the easiest as it is all bolted so i dont have to get anything welded. Additionally, we really lucked out because the back hatch of our TV BARELY clears the current tongue box. As a matter of fact if we try to open it when the TV and camper are not perfectly straight there is not enough room.

Regarding the water storage in pipes, yeah hadnt figured it all out yet. Im thinking if we do try it then i will want to make them removable so i can drop one end a bit to get the water out. Additionally, going side to side we can stay in the void of the trailer between the side to side crossmembers. Front to back it would end up hanging down. That whole thing is just some ideas right now.

you won't have to weld anything but won't you have to drill new holes for the leaf spring mounts and such?

[jonesnforcampin]

Hey jhorton,
Yeah, I moved the axle back, flipped the trailer back over and put the camper back on it. I did have to drill holes for the leaf spring mounts, the fender mounts and had to move the rear latches that help hold the camper on the trailer. All of that was easier for me than having to take it somewhere and have anything welded. Not to mention the cost as I don't have any welding knowledge or equipment.

Moving the trailer around afterward it has noticeably more tongue weight in just the trailer by hand. I have not tried towing it yet. Maybe Saturday.

[jhorton3]

Hey jhorton,
Yeah, I moved the axle back, flipped the trailer back over and put the camper back on it. I did have to drill holes for the leaf spring mounts, the fender mounts and had to move the rear latches that help hold the camper on the trailer. All of that was easier for me than having to take it somewhere and have anything welded. Not to mention the cost as I don't have any welding knowledge or equipment.

Moving the trailer around afterward it has noticeably more tongue weight in just the trailer by hand. I have not tried towing it yet. Maybe Saturday.

Interesting. Seems like you are heading in the right direction. Prior to doing this, did you have any issues of the coupler 'popping' up on the ball when you would hit small bumps? That's the issue I am running into.