Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby fishboat » Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:15 pm

Atomic77 wrote:This last round was 5200. I've used it a lot on our race boats. I seriously thought I nailed it this time. Went 2 months through a bunch of storms without a leak! Then the other morning I came out to a wet spot on the corner of the bed. Big waste of time and money.


Did the 5200 lose adhesion to the window or the frame? Or did the water come in between the frame and wood? If you use it on boats..I'm guessing you know it works pretty well(once fully cured).

(just trying to help..)
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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby Atomic77 » Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:21 pm

fishboat wrote:
Atomic77 wrote:This last round was 5200. I've used it a lot on our race boats. I seriously thought I nailed it this time. Went 2 months through a bunch of storms without a leak! Then the other morning I came out to a wet spot on the corner of the bed. Big waste of time and money.


Did the 5200 lose adhesion to the window or the frame? Or did the water come in between the frame and wood? If you use it on boats..I'm guessing you know it works pretty well(once fully cured).

(just trying to help..)
I have used 5200 and clear tape on the running surface of a Hydroplane that did 188 mph in the straight and held until I could get it patched for the final. It's good stuff!! As far as these stupid windows, I honestly don't know this time because I haven't had them apart again. It's somewhere between the glass and frame looks like, where the seam is welded but until it's apart I won't know for sure. Junk.

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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby mbergen » Tue Jun 11, 2019 8:12 pm

2019-06-11 20.13.16.jpg
photo taken from top - side that faces out - rubber has been removed - glass sits on metal ledge below.
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2019-06-11 20.12.54.jpg
Photo taken from bottom of window - side that faces inside of teardrop
2019-06-11 20.12.54.jpg (75.07 KiB) Viewed 1118 times
2019-06-11 20.12.32.jpg
Photo taken from top - side that faces out
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fishboat wrote:I wish I could see one of these windows. I've searched the web and haven't found any close-ups that are useful. I have to believe the window is rebuildable-sealable with 3M 5200(black). 5200 will stick to anything and take a few days to a week+ to cure up(forever). You can put a nice surface/control the bead laid-down bead by dipping your (glove covered) finger in toluene or xylenes as 5200 won't stick to it. %200 will still cure up fine..not affected by toluene or xylenes(also sold as xylol).


I'm not sure if these pictures will help you, but I removed the window from my camper tonight, to try and work on it and took some photos.

I'm going to try an elevate the edge of where it attaches to the teardrop, so water runs around it vs on top of it, if I can figure out how, before I work on the leak. My primary problem is water puddling on the window in one corner.

As you can tell I haven't had a chance to clean them up yet.
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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby Minics04 » Wed Jun 12, 2019 6:23 am

Atomic77 wrote:
fishboat wrote:
Atomic77 wrote:This last round was 5200. I've used it a lot on our race boats. I seriously thought I nailed it this time. Went 2 months through a bunch of storms without a leak! Then the other morning I came out to a wet spot on the corner of the bed. Big waste of time and money.


Did the 5200 lose adhesion to the window or the frame? Or did the water come in between the frame and wood? If you use it on boats..I'm guessing you know it works pretty well(once fully cured).

(just trying to help..)
I have used 5200 and clear tape on the running surface of a Hydroplane that did 188 mph in the straight and held until I could get it patched for the final. It's good stuff!! As far as these stupid windows, I honestly don't know this time because I haven't had them apart again. It's somewhere between the glass and frame looks like, where the seam is welded but until it's apart I won't know for sure. Junk.

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The Seam on my window is not welded. It looks like it just has sealant in the seam.
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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby Atomic77 » Thu Jun 13, 2019 10:36 pm

Minics04 wrote:
Atomic77 wrote:
fishboat wrote:
Atomic77 wrote:This last round was 5200. I've used it a lot on our race boats. I seriously thought I nailed it this time. Went 2 months through a bunch of storms without a leak! Then the other morning I came out to a wet spot on the corner of the bed. Big waste of time and money.


Did the 5200 lose adhesion to the window or the frame? Or did the water come in between the frame and wood? If you use it on boats..I'm guessing you know it works pretty well(once fully cured).

(just trying to help..)
I have used 5200 and clear tape on the running surface of a Hydroplane that did 188 mph in the straight and held until I could get it patched for the final. It's good stuff!! As far as these stupid windows, I honestly don't know this time because I haven't had them apart again. It's somewhere between the glass and frame looks like, where the seam is welded but until it's apart I won't know for sure. Junk.

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The Seam on my window is not welded. It looks like it just has sealant in the seam.
I guess I should have said, "Where the seam is supposed to be welded" would have been more accurate

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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby Tomterrific » Fri Jun 14, 2019 5:24 am

Here is the process I'll suggest to install your leaky window. It goes along with what happens in a previous post I made about the window being stiff and the frame warps when installed. Therefore, the seal is forever being spread apart.

If the window and frame are now separate you should install the frame to the camper. Only after the frame is installed should the window be sealed to the frame. Any bend/warp in the frame will be sealed by the goop and the window glass will not have the sealant under constant tension.

Tt
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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby fishboat » Fri Jun 14, 2019 6:31 am

What Tom said..and I'd use a marine bedding compound like 3m 4200 (or equivalent, not silicone caulk) as you'll have a better chance of removing the window-frame at some point if you need/want to, and 3m 5200 for bedding the glass into the frame. 5200 is permanent. If you haven't worked with 5200..practice a little first(applying, removing, shaping)..jumping in without knowing what to expect could be a bit of a mess. Don't get 5200 on anything you don't want it on as it'll be tough to remove it in porous surfaces or surfaces that can't stand up to a removal solvent like acetone. Have a roll of paper towels and some acetone handy when you start. Maybe tape off adjacent areas to protect them and ease cleanup.

Edit for added refs:
(Atomic77..you work with boats and I'm sure you're familiar with bedding hardware..)

One key point/tip..once you lay the bedding material on to the camper and insert the frame, snug the screws down about half-way or a little more. You want the bedding material to squeeze out everywhere, but don't crank the screws/bolts down tight. You want it to squeeze out everywhere to insure you have sealant in good contact with the frame and camper with no gaps..use more sealant than you think is needed. Put sealant into the screw/bolt holes. Let the bedding compound cure up for a couple days before you tighten the screws/bolts down to their final position.

https://www.boatus.com/boattech/casey/b ... rdware.asp

https://www.riggingdoctor.com/life-aboa ... g-hardware

http://sailingmagazine.net/article-1703 ... lboat.html

https://www.soundingsonline.com/feature ... ored-decks

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UO6BOjYOyKw
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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby Atomic77 » Sun Jun 23, 2019 2:39 pm

Ok folks... tell me where I can get two more windows. I hate them, but the holes are pretty specific and I'm done with these two. My only hope is to buy two more and hope they have improved. I've done it all. 5200 is the best sealant I know of besides gluing them in with Hysol. But for obvious reasons I can't do that. So please tell me where to get some, as my supplier no longer carries them. (Hmmm. Wonder why?) I'm in a pinch and have two holes in my coach. Time is of the essence. Thank you.

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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby mbergen » Wed Jun 26, 2019 7:41 pm

Atomic77 wrote:Ok folks... tell me where I can get two more windows. I hate them, but the holes are pretty specific and I'm done with these two.


I have had no luck finding any other window. Tonight after trying to reseal the window it’s leaking worse than when I started. I give up. I’m going to make a window out of plexiglass instead. fewer places to leak I figure. It may not look as professional but at least I figure I’ll be dry and can actually use the trailer for camping. Good luck.
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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby Atomic77 » Wed Jun 26, 2019 8:03 pm

mbergen wrote:
Atomic77 wrote:Ok folks... tell me where I can get two more windows. I hate them, but the holes are pretty specific and I'm done with these two.


I have had no luck finding any other window. Tonight after trying to reseal the window it’s leaking worse than when I started. I give up. I’m going to make a window out of plexiglass instead. fewer places to leak I figure. It may not look as professional but at least I figure I’ll be dry and can actually use the trailer for camping. Good luck.
I have done everything I know to do. I worked on a professional race team and I took F16 fighter cockpits apart and rebuilt them for use in unlimited hydroplanes. I literally cut the cowlings apart and glued new ones in with 5200 marine sealant. So I'm no chump when it comes to this kind of work. But I'm telling you, don't feel bad because I still can't get the stupid things to seal. They may for a while but we had a hard rain the other night and I had another wet spot on my bed. It's really irritating.

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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby Minics04 » Thu Jun 27, 2019 6:33 am

Ok, I don't want to jinx myself, but my window is sealed for now and not leaking.

I feel the key was to remove the paint/powder coat from where the window seats into the frame. I went down to bare aluminum. I think this gave the sealant something to bite into. The seal feels much stronger and stuck than ever before.

Long term, I don't know how the seal will hold up with possible flex or vibrations from traveling, but for now it seems stuck and water tight.

On another note, I have also thought about replacing with a polycarbonate window. That might be the next step if this fails long term.

Fingers, toes, and other things crossed for now that it stays fixed!!
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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby Atomic77 » Thu Jun 27, 2019 6:36 am

Minics04 wrote:Ok, I don't want to jinx myself, but my window is sealed for now and not leaking.

I feel the key was to remove the paint/powder coat from where the window seats into the frame. I went down to bare aluminum. I think this gave the sealant something to bite into. The seal feels much stronger and stuck than ever before.

Long term, I don't know how the seal will hold up with possible flex or vibrations from traveling, but for now it seems stuck and water tight.

On another note, I have also thought about replacing with a polycarbonate window. That might be the next step if this fails long term.

Fingers, toes, and other things crossed for now that it stays fixed!!
Yeah. I took off the paint too. Had it down the road yet? This last one went a year. Then boom. Irritating. I really think it is because it is cheap aluminum, extruded, then riveted and not welded. There are unwelded seams that should be solid. In the temperature changes they warp and twist. They are narrow but too long for this construction method. Eventually, maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but eventually something is going to give.

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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby Minics04 » Fri Jun 28, 2019 6:21 am

Atomic77 wrote:
Minics04 wrote:Ok, I don't want to jinx myself, but my window is sealed for now and not leaking.

I feel the key was to remove the paint/powder coat from where the window seats into the frame. I went down to bare aluminum. I think this gave the sealant something to bite into. The seal feels much stronger and stuck than ever before.

Long term, I don't know how the seal will hold up with possible flex or vibrations from traveling, but for now it seems stuck and water tight.

On another note, I have also thought about replacing with a polycarbonate window. That might be the next step if this fails long term.

Fingers, toes, and other things crossed for now that it stays fixed!!
Yeah. I took off the paint too. Had it down the road yet? This last one went a year. Then boom. Irritating. I really think it is because it is cheap aluminum, extruded, then riveted and not welded. There are unwelded seams that should be solid. In the temperature changes they warp and twist. They are narrow but too long for this construction method. Eventually, maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but eventually something is going to give.

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Yes I have had it down the road. You are correct-a year from now it might leak. I hope not, but I am already planning my next move(In the back of my mind).
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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby mbergen » Sat Jun 29, 2019 9:41 am

This was my solution. I just finished replacing the window with 1/4” acrylic. The butyl tape is not beautiful but at least it’s not leaking. I may replace the butyl tape on the edges at some point with something I can paint blue like the rest of my trim but for now at least I’ll be able to use the camper.
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Re: Stargazer Window Leak-Caulk???

Postby Atomic77 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 9:59 am

A man's gotta do what a man's gotta do. (Or woman of course) Sorry for your pain, I feel it believe me. Run a tape line at both sides of the butyl, mask off the plexi and camper, then shoot it. Any color, but black will look most closely to the original. You"ll need to scuff the plexi a bit for adhesion. Most will never notice. On the inside, put some glue (4200, silicone, whatver) on the edge of the trim ring and glue it in place. Maybe paint the wood black to match the trim before you do it. That will clean up the hole and trim it out. Glad you are leak free!

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Last edited by Atomic77 on Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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