Wood sided trailer is having issues. Suggestions wanted

[lacofdfireman]

So what about using this Fiberglass Resin...

Stay away from (that) polyester resin. I'd recommend Raka epoxy and their 4 oz cloth. And get their pumps for easy mixing.

http://www.raka.com/epoxy.html

You might Youtube "fiberglassing cedar strip canoes" to get an idea on fiberglassing. Mix 1/2 cup batches otherwise they'll "pop off."

This may sound odd, but I'm glad you stripped it down. And yes, 1/4" Baltic birch.



Tony

p.s. I'd name her The Phoenix. Rises from the ashes.

Thanks for the info about not using that Bondo Resin. I just had YouTubed and read on some boat forums not to use this on wood. It wasn’t the same as an epoxy Resin.

I really think I’m going to reskin again with 1/4” Baltic Birch then coat the exterior skin with “The Mix” then do the PMF method for my exterior coat. I’ve looked into the Raka and fiberglass cloth but figure I’m looking at $3-400 minimum just for that alone. I’m thinking I can do the PMF for probably less than half that at the most. It won’t be as pretty but we use it off road so it gets beat up pretty good so I’m not shooting for a masterpiece. I think the PMF with paint will be perfect.


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[tony.latham]

I’m looking at $3-400 minimum just for that alone.

For my next build this is what it will cost me to fiberglass it:

13 yards of 4 oz cloth: $86
3 gallon epoxy kit: $168
Two pumps: $10

With shipping, it is close to $300. But bulletproof. Or at least a couple of rounds from a Red Ryder.

Tony

[lacofdfireman]

I’m looking at $3-400 minimum just for that alone.

For my next build this is what it will cost me to fiberglass it:

13 yards of 4 oz cloth: $86
3 gallon epoxy kit: $168
Two pumps: $10

With shipping, it is close to $300. But bulletproof. Or at least a couple of rounds from a Red Ryder.

Tony

I just replied to your post on another thread. Would you mind linking me to the exact Resin and cloth when you have a minute. No rush. Thank you.


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[MatTech]

It's a shame you had to tear off the skin but as you found out, once the water has started to separate your plys there isn't much left to do. If you're going the PMF route over plywood, wouldn't the TB2 be the best thing to adhere your canvas? I personally wouldn't do TB2 direct over foam but on plywood it should bite right into the wood and give good durability. Or maybe I'm missing something and people are using the gripper primer for everything these days.

For my build I'm back to skinning with aluminum. I really liked the liquid rubber product but after calculating how much I would need to get a semi smooth finish not showing the geotextile underneath (probably 6 coats at 100sqft per gallon per coat) I would need more than 10 gallons and I simply can't justify that cost.

As others have mentioned fiberglass reinforced epoxy resin is amazing stuff but in my opinion very hard to get a good surface finish when doing an exterior layup. If you want a boat hull like finish you will have to sand for days. The fiberglass boats they make are laid up inside a mould with the gelcoat applied first then usually vacuum bagged which isn't at all practical for a one of build.

I think you're on the right track with the PMF over ply, make sure to take pictures.

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[bobhenry]

Chubby is now 12 years old and has spent a decade of that in the weather so he is not doing well either. I have two large bolts of cubical material that I inherited from the previous tenant when I rented my 3000 sq ft shop. I am going to experiment with polar seal and a grey latex enamel mix and soak and coat with the material layer. If It works I am way ahead and if not no worse off as the skin finish will be removed from the OSB shell.

[lacofdfireman]

I think the more I learn about using the epoxy resin the more I’m against doing it. From what I’m reading there is lots of extra work involved with sanding to get the desired look and feel of good fiberglass. I just don’t think i have the time to do this. Making a cup at a time seems real labor intensive. Don’t want to sound like I don’t want to put forth any effort in this trailer but for me time and money is a huge factor. I’m not trying to build a show piece just a good solid trailer that i won’t have to tear the walls off in 6 months or even 5 years. I’ve read good things about PMF. It’s been used for 100 years or more with boat building.

I’m going to try PMF for sure.


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[saywhatthat]

Where I get the trailtop railing Has said Don't waste your money on epoxy. Pol. will flex more so less cracks You have to cover epoxy for UV . For pol. that dose not have gel-coat paint with oil base pant will stop water from wicking

[lacofdfireman]

Some progress today.






Getting it reskinned. I ended up using 1/4” Douglas Fir with one sanded side. The place I go was out of Baltic Birch and didn’t know when they would have more in. I figured since I’m doing PMF outer it shouldn’t really matter to much.


Will this work for “The Mix”.



I have some of this on hand and some mineral spirits so wondering if this will work. I mixed some up in a paint tray but it doesn’t seem to mix very well together. The MinnWax sinks to the bottom and the Mineral spirits just floats on top of it so I’m not sure
If these are ok to use as “The Mix”


Also I pulled out my gripper paint and a bed sheet to try out and see how it looks on some plywood and see how good it adheres. I’ll check it tomorrow but it may take longer to dry since it’s in the 40’s out today.






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[working on it]

...Will this work for “The Mix”.

reduced-size image

spar.JPG (114.88 KiB) Viewed 1448 times

I have some of this on hand and some mineral spirits so wondering if this will work. I mixed some up in a paint tray but it doesn’t seem to mix very well together. The MinnWax sinks to the bottom and the Mineral spirits just floats on top of it so I’m not sure
If these are ok to use as “The Mix”....

Not really. Water and oil don't mix (or water-based and oil-based), IMHO. I did some testing of the "mix", with my chosen polyurethane (Minwax Fast-Drying Semi-Gloss) on small pieces of scrap plywood, before the actual coating day came for the exterior shell. I hadn't used the "mix" when installing my two-part floor - 1/2" birch ply coated completely on top with Tite Bond 2, and with 1/4" Luan glued (and perimeter-screwed) to it, laying all on top of frame and cross-members. The luan top was triple coated with pure poly, since it was to be inside, away from rain and UV, and completely covered by rubber/carpet floor matting, while the underside was sealed with many coats of spray-on automotive undercoating. The exposed perimeter edges of the floor were still raw, but would be sealed along with the cabin shell, with "mix" and paint, later.

Back to the testing....I was using a quart-sized can of paint thinner, but ran out quickly. I asked my wife to pick up some more at Walmart, while I was at work, so I could resume the testing. Well, she bought some "odorless", milky-white crap that was labeled as thinner. It wouldn't mix up with the poly, and wouldn't even clean the brushes. I then got the cheapest, smelliest paint thinner I could find, and the "mix" test went great. Having already decided on the oil-based poly & paints, all with high VOC levels, it was reasonable that only a thinner of similar properties would work, instead of the water-based crap.

I've been working around some volatile, dangerous chemicals, at work and play, for my whole adult life. From making my own 118+ octane racing fuel to using solvents that will eat rubber gloves to clean parts (heck, I keep brake cleaner around as a hand-cleaner- the good stuff, not the new stuff), I've grown used-to the high VOC contents. My rule: get the smelliest chemical (or paint or thinner) since it will do a better job. Of course, your mileage may vary, but it's my opinion.

[lacofdfireman]

So,I hope I didn’t screwup my new sides now since I ended up using some of this MinnWax Urethane mixed with Mineral spirits at a ratio of around 25% MinnWax to 75% Mineral spirits. Think I screwed up my new sides? I figure the mineral spirits will most likely just evaporate off.

So I guess I need to figure out what I’m doing here with “The Mix” Any Chance someone could actually screen shot what I should be using?

Is this the right stuff?




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[working on it]

Yep, it is oil-based. same basic chemistry as the Minwax I used, but with UV protection (mine didn't need any, as it was to be painted over). I used the Spar poly you show, as a coating on a walking stick, and also on a shillelagh/cane, that I made two years ago (for the day coming soon, that I'll need help walking). The cane is exposed to UV year-round, sitting on the gun rack in my truck's window, and I've left the walking stick outside my garage, in all weather, for a year now...no adverse effects there, either.

[lacofdfireman]

Yep, it is oil-based. same basic chemistry as the Minwax I used, but with UV protection (mine didn't need any, as it was to be painted over). I used the Spar poly you show, as a coating on a walking stick, and also on a shillelagh/cane, that I made two years ago (for the day coming soon, that I'll need help walking). The cane is exposed to UV year-round, sitting on the gun rack in my truck's window, and I've left the walking stick outside my garage, in all weather, for a year now...no adverse effects there, either.

So what are your thoughts on me using the water based MinnWax that I had laying around with the mineral spirits? Can I just go right over it with this PolyUrethane and Mineral spirits? I’d imagine I can.


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[John61CT]

Don't have specific advice, but I'd slow down and be certain you're using the optimal materials for the job.

A smart person learns from his mistakes, but a truly wise person learns from the mistakes of others.

Hasty slapdash experimentation is not the way to get to

Do it right, do it once.

[lacofdfireman]

Well here we go. Started doing the PMF this afternoon. Hopefully finish the Titebond ll and the canvas tomorrow. Using full strength under the canvas to stick it to the sides of the trailer then will size the outer side of the canvas with a Titebond ll and water mixed at a 50/50 ratio or somewhere around there. After that I’ll coat the entire trailer in gripper primer then do another 3-4 coats of latex paint over the gripper primer. Should be good to go after all of that. My toughest part so far has been the edges. I’m trying to cut straight lines but its not that easy for me it seems.

Here are a few pics of today’s progress.






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[lacofdfireman]

Well the exterior is once again finished. Hopefully this time will be the last time. Really enjoyed trying PMF. Hopefully it’s as good as people claim. If so I should never have to worry about it again. Super happy with how it turned out. I like it better than the Raptor liner.










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