Still confused regarding frame grounding for AC and DC.

[IraRat]

Okay, Steve. Your answer wasn't simple enough for this moron here. I thank you, but could you please try again and consider the following:

1) Look at that link again, for "our" panel, because I don't understand the descriptive.

http://www.boatersworld.com/webapp/wcs/ ... escription

It's listing more circuits than I see on the box. I only see a main breaker, and 3 other lines This is all I NEED for the 3 lines I plan to run.

So I just don't get it. I think BoatersWorld site may be incorrect. Does yours look exactly like this one, and does it match the specs as they state them?

2) Frame Grounding:

Let's say that this weekend, I want to attach and test all of my cabin lights, porch lights, receptacles, etc. WITHOUT having this panel yet.

I actually started this this PAST weekend, just connecting the right cabin light, but all I did was take my main "right daisy chain" feeder lines, temporarily connected them to a plug, and stuck it into an extension chord running to the house.

Remember--no panel yet. But lo and behold, I had light. I attached positive, negative, and ground. So now I have to daisychain the rest of my devices, all with separate grounds.

If I decided to ground to the frame, do I just ground it from the PANEL, or are you saying I should be doing something regarding connecting the individual devices/outlets? I hope this AIN'T the case, because the way wires are just sticking out of the wall now, I don't see any way to attach anything directly to the frame from there.

Ooops. See, I TOLD you: My head just exploded.

And Dale, if you ever feel bad about your electrical knowledge, just think of me.

[Steve_Cox]

Ira, "our panel" in the picture has 4 breakers and 3 plugged holes for future breakers... top one is the main breaker the ones under that are the branch circuits. My panel dosen't look exactly like it the faceplate is black. The panel will have a terminal on each branch circuit for the hot wire for each device. It will also have a neutral bus and a grounding bus. That means just a metal bar with screws in it to bolt the wires for neutral and ground. It will also come with a wiring diagram which you will be able to figure out. You arn't going to like the fact that you should have 3 wires running to each outlet or device. Key word is should, will it kill you if you don't? probably not. THe panel will work just like the way you tested your lights with two wires, should you do it that way? No. It will work? Yes. Do I care if there is no ground wire? Not really. But, if you have a bare wire in any of your lights and it has a metal frame and one of your kids touches it, it will probably be the last time they or your wife will ever be in the teardrop. She will se to that. I don't know if I answered your questions. My head is starting to hurt...

Steve

[IraRat]

I have three wires for each line, so I can daisy the ground just like I'm daisying the positive and negatives?

I also promise to let this avatar only live for a day or so, because it will SURELY give you a headache.

[Ken A Hood]

I would hope that is ANYONE has any doubts about doing their own wiring; or are uncomfortable about trying to wire it will take it( and the accessories/panel etc...) to a qualified service center.

You could always do alot of the setup yourself; running wire to your accessories( fans/lights...etc) locating the panel/battery; roughing in lights/switches, but let the pro's do the actual wiring up to finish the installation...

[Steve_Cox]

I would hope that is ANYONE has any doubts about doing their own wiring; or are uncomfortable about trying to wire it will take it( and the accessories/panel etc...) to a qualified service center.

You could always do alot of the setup yourself; running wire to your accessories( fans/lights...etc) locating the panel/battery; roughing in lights/switches, but let the pro's do the actual wiring up to finish the installation...

Good advise Ken, would you consider a knowledgable and experienced friend almost as good as a qualified service center/Pro? I think Ira could probably find some good help in South Florida, lots of qualified Boat and RV electrical types there that just love cold Bud..

Steve

[bdosborn]

Hypothetically writing. On your AC power the neutral and the ground are bonded together and the ground is bolted to the frame. You go to "Poppy's by the Tree" campground and it turns out Poppy is an amateur electrician. You get the campsite with reverse polarity (all Poppy's campsites have reverse polarity). You set up and plug in your power cord. You go to take your bicycle off the tongue mounted bike rack and suddenly you find that you can't let go of the handlebars because you're getting about 112 of the 117 volts available right into your continuously constricting muscles in your hands. Don't you wish for a split second you hadn't tied the ground to the frame as you feebly jump into the air to get your wet bare feet off the damp ground and break the circuit?

Steve in St Augustine

PS - I'm building a woody teardrop and have a ground wire to my frame. I also have a "reverse polarity " warning light on my AC electrical panel. There are lots of Poppys out there in the world.

First off, you never, ever bond the neutral to the ground wire in a trailer. Now, assuming you have done that (but you're not supposed to), you plug in to reverse polarity and you grab the bike, nothing will happen. You just connected the hot wire straight to ground when you plugged in your trailer and the circuit breaker either popped or you melted some wires. Never bond the neutral to the ground...
Bruce

[Dee Bee]

Mike Nemeth's article on 12 volts mentions doing that, but with a 3-stage charger. I can't get his site up, and the cached version doesn't show any of his diagrams or photos.

You can find it here.
http://www.ccis.com/home/mnemeth/12volt/12volt.htm

DEE BEE

[cracker39]

Thanks, Dee Bee. I got it this time. The first time i tried i was given bart.ccis.home and your link has www.ccis.home. That works. Now I can see the diagrams.

[Ken A Hood]

My AC panel has a GFCI outlet on it; and another breaker for the Charger. But since my charger isn't hardwired, I pan on plugging it into the GFCI (When I need to charge) and use the other circuit to run the AC outlets (1 in the galley [GFCI] and 2 in the cabin run from the 1[GFCI] in the galley).
And I also took a closer look at the AC wiring in the panel, and it's all stranded wire, so I'm OK there as well.

[xe1ufo]

Hey IraRat:

You doing o.k. with this last hurricane blowing through there? Hope so!
Blessings.

[IraRat]

Hey IraRat:

You doing o.k. with this last hurricane blowing through there? Hope so!
Blessings.

Thanks for asking, Doc. We're cool.

Whether I'll survive my electrical installation, that's another matter.

But seriously, in response to the above suggestions about getting "professional help" with this, come on. What I'm doing is the simplest installation of all.

And aside from Powder, whom I trust, I guarantee you that down here in South Florida, I will find 10 electricians who will give me 10 totally different opinions.

All I'm doing is running 3 lines/circuits from a distrubution panel...positive, negative and neutral wires for each...and connecting devices to those lines that all have positive, negative and neutral connectors.

My basic question was, which I believe has been answered, is yes:

Ground the ground connectors from the panel to the steel frame.

[wentzzee]

Cracker 39
You got it right you don't have to frame ground if you run a ground wire thru your harness. As to the AC why would you frame ground it when your trailer is no part ot the system for an AC?

[cracker39]

Cracker 39
You got it right you don't have to frame ground if you run a ground wire thru your harness. As to the AC why would you frame ground it when your trailer is no part ot the system for an AC?

Bruce convinced me via email of the merits of grounding the 120VAC to the chassis. I still do not plan to ground my 12VDC to the ground as I will have all devices on separate two-wire circuits from the device to the fuse panel and ground terminal block, and I won't have a converter in the system. Here's my schematic:

[IraRat]

Oy, that looks complicated, Dale!!!

But since I'm just doing 120, that part of your schematic is all I have to do.

So what's so complicated about THAT?

[cracker39]

Ira, it really isn't complicated. I'm just running two stranded 2+gound to the rear outlet and one to the front outlet, along with my 12V 2-wire runs for the lights, fans, and a 12V outlet front and rear. I'll use my 30 AMP shore power cord connected directly to the circuit breaker box. Flagship RV sells one with a plug on one end and the other end has the wires stripped ready to connect to anywhere. My only problem is that the only way I can find the stranded 2+gound is by the foot at either HD or Lowes and it is $.55 per foot for 14 gauge (ouch). Don't worry, I'll get an electrician to help me get the box and breakers connected correctly.