Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

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Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

Postby jseyfert3 » Thu Feb 06, 2014 1:38 am

Just got to the stage where my frame is assembled and need to pack the hubs. I read around, and settled on the large socket and hammer method to remove the inner bearing and seal without ruining the seal. Well, lets just say it didn't work. I mean it did get the bearing and seal out, but not only did I ruin the seal, but the bearing itself.
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1st Tire - Ruined Seal and Bearing by jseyfert3, on Flickr

So, reading around again, I find I'm not thefirst person to ruin a bearing while trying to keep the seal intact. In that thread, he was using the hammer method like I did. He said the seals are $1/each from HF and the bearings are $5.95, but that was back in 2009. Either way, bearing = 6x cost of seal. I will call HF tomorrow, find out current prices, and order a bunch of spare seals and probably an entire spare hub assembly.

Oh, and now that was was ruined, and the bearing, I said I wasn't going to ruin another bearing, so I used my Lisle Seal Puller I bought for the trailer but didn't want to use cause I didn't want to damage the seal. Well, I can say it works great. Took a whopping 3 seconds to pop that seal right out. Damaged the seal, yes, but the bearing was hardly touched, much less hammered upon.
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2nd Tire - Ruined Seal, Intact Bearing by jseyfert3, on Flickr

From now on, I plan to use this handy seal puller and just keep spare seals on hand. For $1-2, I'd rather ruin them then the bearings, plus it's fast, no messing around. Stick it between the seal and bearing, push in, then rock the tool backwards and pop, there's the seal.
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Re: Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

Postby KCStudly » Thu Feb 06, 2014 8:39 am

Another method is to remove the outer bearing and washer, put the nut back on, pull the hub out to where the inner bearing is pulling against the nut and give the hub a good straight yank.

I've tried this method and it did not damage the seal lip or tension spring, but the seal did not fit back in the bore tightly. It had taken a set from being driven in, so... best advice is to plan on replacing seal each time. :thumbsup:
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Re: Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

Postby MtnDon » Thu Feb 06, 2014 10:28 am

To me the thought of trying to save the seal does not make sense. Seals are cheap enough and if you use new ones you never have to go back and do the whole thing all over again soon because the seal was nicked or something and you never noticed when you reassembled. Plus as was stated it is quick.
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Re: Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

Postby les45 » Thu Feb 06, 2014 11:02 am

I agree that there is no sense in trying to re-use a seal. One thing that I have found recently is that some of the DIY trailers (specifically my NT 5X8) come with non-reinforced, single lip seals with metal casings. These seals will fail prematurely and should be replaced before you put them on the road. Both of mine failed after less than one year. I only use the double lip, spring reinforced rubber types now.
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Re: Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

Postby Mary C » Fri Feb 07, 2014 5:20 pm

I ordered extra seals and bearings for my trailer and have buried the bearings in the (a New) can of bearing grease. the seals are in a sealed plastic bag and I have another plastic zip lock bag containing both. I know how to take the seals and bearings out and install them if I had too but hopefully I will find someone else to do it, but I at least will have the parts so I wont be stranded till parts are found at the repair shop in some small little town out in nowhere.

When I ordered the extra seals and bearings they did not have an extra hub.

I also have put together a service chain that doubles er....triples er........quadruples as tow chain, DO coal cooking chain and extra safety chain and also a hanging chain for DO over campfire. this chain is put together with other hooks and coupling devices.

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Re: Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

Postby jseyfert3 » Fri Feb 07, 2014 10:00 pm

I hope they get back to me soon. I emailed parts@harborfreight.com for a quote, and got an auto reply that said two days. That was yesterday, but I didn't want to wait two days, then another two after I told them how to pay and what to get. So I called the number they said to call if I needed quicker service, and "do to high call volume" was on hold for 7 minutes, then they transfered me to voicemail automatically, guess they don't want to keep people on hold, even though I was okay with it?

I could probably get them locally, but I didn't want to pay a bunch more then the HF ones cost. Still, I may look into it, if HF doesn't get back to me early next week.
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Re: Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

Postby jseyfert3 » Sat Feb 08, 2014 2:55 am

As I don't want to wait too long for HF stuff, if they don't get back to me by Mon or Tue, I've already located other sources of parts. They were a lot easier to find then I thought and some people on here made it sound, all I had to do was type "30 52 10 seal" on eBay and got instant results. But they aren't the cheapest, and Google finds results with the same search term. So far I've found these for $3.64 each, if you buy 10 you get 20% off, and shipping on a ten pack via USPS is $4.12. Even cheaper at $3.50 to ship if they came in a padded envelope vs a package, but I figure you don't want the seals getting smashed.

Also found bearings on eBay for $5.17 and $4.80 total shipping no matter how many you buy, again, I could simply type "30205 bearing" and they popped right up.
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Re: Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

Postby jseyfert3 » Mon Feb 10, 2014 12:59 pm

Wanting to get my trailer rolling (I'm going to use it to bring back 4x8 sheets of OSB and foam), I ordered the above seals and bearing on Saturday. The seals from AVX end up being $2.90/each. Of course, I would hear back from HF this morning, seals from them are $5.99 for a 4-pack. That's $1.50 vs the $2.90 I paid, but no clue how much shipping is or how long it would take. Doens't matter anyhow, my order from AVX is pending and cannot be changed or cancelled anymore.

However, on the bearings, I won out. The above eBay bearings for $5.17/each with a fixed $4.80 shipping even if you order 100 bearings is cheaper then HF, by a lot. I ordered 4 bearings, I figure I'll put both new ones in the hub I damaged the one, and have two (plus the good one from the hub) as spares. HF charges $11.99 per bearing at this time.

Replacement hubs must be special ordered and have a minimum wait time of 10 weeks, so if you think you may need one or want a spare, get one ASAP. They are currently $18.50 each plus S+H, and the grease fittings on the side are $1.00 each.

To wrap it up, dust caps are $4.99 for a 3-pack, plus S+H. Individual castle nuts, cotter pins, etc, are not available seperately, only as a bag of mounting components. If you need these, use the phone and part numbers from my email, for some reason they don't list the inbound sales department on their website.
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HF prices by jseyfert3, on Flickr
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Re: Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

Postby roachslayer » Fri May 23, 2014 10:32 am

I just bought a new HF trailer (the 1720lb model 94564). Before buying, I read many online posts about bearings. I read the exact instructions, which say the wheel bearings MUST be packed/greased before use. And in my mind, this means inner and outer, not just the easy outer ones.

HF ships this thing with the inner bearings and seals already in place, which IMHO, is STUPID - a manufacturing defect when you consider
    a) the requirement to grease these yourself,
    b) the fact that seals should be replaced, not re-used, and
    c) pre-assembled seals are, um, used! The manufacturer defect is in the process, if not the product itself.

So… I called HF to order replacement seals for my trailer immediately after I bought it and removed the seals. I explained that two bearings and seals are defective (which they are after you remove them), and had them ship me new seals and bearings within the 90 day warranty.

I believe this is the correct solution. I am really big on being ethical too, and I believe this is ethical on my part. Unethical is selling an unusable product.

Lots of hints out there about how to remove and re-use seals… ugh. You should NOT have to! These seals and bearings should not have been installed, OR, should have been installed with the proper grease ready to go. It costs HF NOTHING to simply include the bearings/seals in a BOX rather than pre-installed in the hub. Therefore, they should make this change in the product. The only way they will learn is by losing money within the warranty period to people who demand seals that are questionably damaged as a result of their install instructions which include packing grease in bearings that are already installed (and made defective) by them!

New owners - please stop settling for putting more $ out, or reducing the operating life of your seals by trying to re-use them. Get HF to send you new ones. Problem solved.

BTW - it took 3 tries to get HF to send me these parts. Apparently, the parts sales folks have them in stock, but warranty parts are supposedly handled by a different department that claimed they are magically now out of stock (discontinued during the few seconds of phone transfer? Riiiight. I didn’t let that run-around last long, and finally got a rep willing to acknowledge that this HF trailer and parts that have been on the market for years is NOT discontinued. Free parts sent. :)
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Re: Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

Postby jseyfert3 » Sat May 24, 2014 2:15 pm

Why did you ask for bearings if you believe you are being ethical? When you remove the seals without trying to save them, like I ended up doing with my seal puller, you will not damage the bearings.

I only damaged one trying to hammer the bearing to get the seal out intact.

Oh, and I completely agree with the stupidity of installing a seal that will most likely be damaged removing it when you are required to remove it before you can ever use it.
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Re: Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

Postby roachslayer » Tue May 27, 2014 12:51 am

Bearings got ruined. Depends on the removal method. I could take pics but suffice it to say, hammering the bearings or trying to slam the bearings against the caste nut damages them.
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Re: Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

Postby bobhenry » Tue May 27, 2014 12:50 pm

roachslayer wrote:, hammering the bearings or trying to slam the bearings against the caste nut damages them.



What do you think side loads like hitting curbs and washboard turns do to the bearing it's the exact same load with a hell of a lot more force.
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Re: Another Ruined Seal and Bearing

Postby cheri832 » Mon Jun 02, 2014 3:57 pm

I used a short piece of 1" wooden dowel and a few taps with a hammer. It was small enough to not foul the races, fit right over the metal inside lip of the bearing cage and didn't tear up the seals. I'm sure I read that somewhere on this site. I've learned everything from tnttt. Anyway.. the wooden dowel worked beautifully (even though it took me three months to get over being scared and get on with it. lol) 8)

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