Not so tiny ultralight trailer build journal?

[Thomcat316]

I'd like a consensus opinion, please!



Now that I've got more than 35K miles on the Lite House I've come to the conclusion that I'd like something a bit...bigger. Something with toilet and a shower, and an inside galley, and sleeping room for four/six....

In other words, I've decided to build a lightweight fifth-wheel.

One that isn't much like your average fifth-wheel behemoth, perhaps 28' overall length, 7'2" width, and about 6'8" off the ground, with the design intent of tightly slipstreaming it behind a Dodge Dakota's cab and having a full-size camper that gets 25MPG+ highway.

The opinion I'm looking for is whether it would be OK to use this forum as a place for the build journal - after all, this thing's not a Teardrop, and it's not really all that "tiny"!

[Greg M]

I know I'd be curious to see what you come up with, so you've got my vote.

[backstrap bandit]

I'm with u tomcat it's all about learning from each other and the wealth of information shared heck I even thought about a goose neck teardrop so build on

[Olddog1]

I'm very much interested. In the dreaming stage now for a 22' standie to replace the 32' fifth wheel we pull to Maine for the summers.

[Ned B]

just a thought, look online for a shadow cruiser 5th wheel trailer. They used to make a 5'er very similar to what you describe.
that wasn't my trailer, but I owned one very similar to it.

[aggie79]

Count me in as wanting to see your build! Composites have always fascinated me. (I'm a huge F1 fan.)

[pchast]

I'd be interested in how you build the hitch...

[KCStudly]

I say go for it. Heck, I'm posting a buddies progress building a pizza oven trailer that isn't even a camper (pushing the envelope a little, but still trailer related). Everyone can still learn something, whether it is how to do a thing or on the flip side, what methods won't work for a particular person's interest.

One comment: my thought on 5th wheels is that they are good for reducing overall length on a really large trailer, get more weight bias onto the TV, and help with the turning radius; but when does the added complication of the structure and hitch arrangement stop being worth it for a smaller trailer, especially a light weight one? 18 ft, 20 ft? Aside from the novelty factor that a small 5th wheel brings, where is the cutoff point that it makes more sense just to build a tag-a-long?

[Ned B]

KC,
you nailed the downside of a 5er, they're heavier simply because of the goose neck and bracing. On the plus side, you get that extra 6 or 8 ft of interior space (linear) over the bed of the truck shortening the overall length vs a comparable footprint in a tag trailer. You also get a much better tow, between the weight distribution and the pivot point being so far forward.

Thomcat,
build away, we'll all watch!

[Thomcat316]

Thanks for all the encouragement! I'll post a note here with a link to the build journal when I actually get started. Step one will be to buy and modify the tow vehicle, so I'm looking for a 2nd Gen Dakota Quad Cab 2WD 5-spd. Anyone want to give one away? The reason the truck comes first is that I have to pull measurements from it to build the trailer - I'm "designing to fit" in order to get the best aerodynamics I can out of it.

Thanks for the heads-up on the Shadow Cruiser, but I'm looking to build a 28-foot trailer that sleeps four with an empty weight of less than half what they have (and only one axle). That is the best looking of the 5th wheels I've seen to date, but I saw a video walkthrough of a 24' that was for sale, and it's not "me". Too much wasted space, if you will; I grew up on sailboats, and most 5th wheels feel a bit cavernous.

Thanks again for the good wishes, and I'll let y'all know when it gets moving.

[tony.latham]

The opinion I'm looking for is whether it would be OK to use this forum as a place for the build journal - after all, this thing's not a Teardrop, and it's not really all that "tiny"!

I'll be interested to follow your unique materials and building methods. Bring it on.

Tony

[Ned B]

I agree, the SC was not close to a decent layout if maximizing space is your criterion. It was a comfy place to hang my hat when I was on the road for work though. I hit 35 or 40 states with that rig. I thought you'd like the profile at least for inspiration though. That much of the trailer worked very well, even with the 'wet' weight of about 3500 lbs, my f150 got decent mileage.

[mustangcats]

I'd like a consensus opinion, please!


I've decided to build a lightweight fifth-wheel.

One that isn't much like your average fifth-wheel behemoth, perhaps 28' overall length, 7'2" width, and about 6'8" off the ground, with the design intent of tightly slipstreaming it behind a Dodge Dakota's cab and having a full-size camper that gets 25MPG+ highway.

What size engine do you plan to get? I had a 2006 Dakota with the 3.7 V6 and it was too underpowered to pull my 12', 2800 lb trailer. It lost too much speed going up long hills. I now have a 2011 Ram 1500 with the 5.7 Hemi V8 and I am very happy with it. You also mentioned 25+ mpg...the best any Dakota can do is about 20 mpg...and that is not towing anything. When I was towing, the Dakota got about 14 mpg and my Ram gets about the same. Dodge Dakota's are great trucks and I had 2 of them...but not many people feel they are good towing vehicles.

[Thomcat316]

What size engine do you plan to get? I had a 2006 Dakota with the 3.7 V6 and it was too underpowered to pull my 12', 2800 lb trailer. It lost too much speed going up long hills. I now have a 2011 Ram 1500 with the 5.7 Hemi V8 and I am very happy with it. You also mentioned 25+ mpg...the best any Dakota can do is about 20 mpg...and that is not towing anything. When I was towing, the Dakota got about 14 mpg and my Ram gets about the same. Dodge Dakota's are great trucks and I had 2 of them...but not many people feel they are good towing vehicles.

I am one of those nuts from over at Ecomodder, and a big part of my fun in doing this is to see just how many miles I can squeeze out of a gallon of Ancient Swamp Juice. My mileage log for the 2014 summer trip shows ca. 9400 miles at about 25.8MPG, and that's with a 2.2L gas pickup. I also like building things, so another part of the entertainment is to see just how light I can make a full-sized travel trailer. I already built a 350lb. 5x12 teardrop, and have the rough "box" weight for this one down under 1000lbs without any optimization.

I am aiming for a max "wet" weight of less than 3000 lbs, and am not afraid of slowing down a bit and downshifting - my 2014 trip had some long mountain pulls in second gear at 28MPH in the Sonoma... Those weren't on interstates, and I was actually passing some larger rigs (V8 Suburban with hitch trailer, etc.) with fair regularity, so it wasn't like I was alone in crawling up the mountains...

The motor I'm planning on for the Dakota is a Mercedes OM606, a 3.0L turbodiesel with a stock output of about the same HP as the 3.7 V6, but a higher torque output peaking at 1600RPM. This should make a better hill motor. As part of the prep for the swap I'm having an injection pump from an OM603 rebuilt with higher volume elements, so if I find the Dakota just isn't going "up" like I want it to I'll replace the turbo and dial up the pump a bit, which will take it into the Hemi's neighborhood for torque.

We'll see how well it all works out - I'm doing a lot of back-of-napkin engineering here, and every comment like yours is appreciated! It gives me a sense of how I should limit my expectations.

[KCStudly]

Don't ever take any of my constructive comments as a deterrent or as intended to lower expectations; rather, as pointing out challenges or issues that you may want to consider in helping you (or anyone) find a suitable path to an end goal.

If the end goal is to have a large light weight camper and you can achieve that more practically with a tag, then it warrants consideration to think about the cut off point where a 5th wheel is no longer practical (like when the roof line is so low that the space over the truck bed is no longer a practical sleeper, or when the cabin space behind the tailgate is big enough without the extra loft). If the end goal is to have a 5th wheel (because they are cool... and those other reasons that were mentioned) and it happens to be compact and light weight, regardless of whether it is more or less practical to build, then "you pays your money and takes your choice". It's all good and it really boils down to what works for you. This is a hobby (for most of us) and the end goal is to have fun, so start there.