New start.

...ask your questions in the appropriate forums BUT document your build here...preferably in a single thread...dates for updates, are appreciated....

New start.

Postby stephent » Fri Jul 22, 2016 4:23 pm

Had this drug home today for a pittance. Started stripping it out in the 124 deg heat index outside, so don't expect Einstein stuff from me. It's been a leaker for a few years and ignored. took new tires and rims, too.
I just bought Chinese 4.80x12 load range B rims and tires. they got it the 10 miles home and will work better under only 700 pounds later after the 4'x8' Benroy gets stuck on top..
But the 52" wide frame after cutting the side extensions off (if I go that way) will require some head scratching..not much though. I have a plan swishing thru my brain cells at this time..
But...it's got a lot of stuff inside I can part/scrap out. Scrap the alum siding/top metal. Cut the back section of frame to 36"-38" aft of wheel centers. It's got a torsion axle setup. Get rid of the surge brake system.
Take a lot of weight off of the frame.. and go forth from there.
It is a start! :D

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New start.

Postby Greg M » Fri Jul 22, 2016 8:01 pm

Yep, pop up frames can be great. My second build I did like you're planning and cut the side wings off and lopped about 18 inches off the tail. Mine didn't have a torsion axle though, so I'm jealous:)
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Re: New start.

Postby stephent » Fri Jul 22, 2016 9:04 pm

Well...I had reservations about using a 1982 year torsion axle. But it was working well when I followed this one 10 miles to my house with the feller I bought it from pulling it with his pickup. I was a little skeered with the new chinese 4.80 x 12's and the one mention I saw of a trailer weight of 1800 to 2200 pounds. Bit this evening I saw a weight of 980 or 1090 pds for a 6 person sleeper for a Jayco from the NADA book.. I guess those tires wasn't as loaded as I thought this morning. :)
It was full of particle board drawers and frames. I threw a bunch out and it rained a bit on them this afternoon. Needless to say they swelled and just melted.
Floor seems to be some kind of treated plywood...slideouts bottoms seem to be the same stuff but thinner. I may already have the bottom of the new TD.
The cushions smell and have a lot of wear on the fabrics..replace those too. Looks like a lot of stuff to trash.. The 4 burner stove/oven looks old..but serviceable...maybe. The sink pump may not be much good...the fresh water holding tank appears to acuatally have water in it...or anti-freeze. There's an old readout type RV converter for the 12 volt system. and a breaker box too. Can't say I'm enamoured of the old interior lights though. ugghh . :thumbdown:
I guess it'll be something to keep me off the streets for a while...maybe.
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Re: New start.

Postby les45 » Sat Jul 23, 2016 4:40 am

I'm working on a project (http://tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=64782) involving a 1989 Jayco pop-up and I was told that the torsion axles are only good for about 20 years. Mine rode well when I bought it but it had lost some of its starting angle and I couldn't remove it to clean it up because two of the bolts were covered up by the torsion arm. I decided to buy a new one from Dexter. I have info on ordering direct from the factory if you are ever interested. They were super to work with. Total cost including shipping was $325 and they shipped within a week. Very simple four bolt replacement. PM me if you want more info. I've discussed the axle issue in my journal.
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Re: New start.

Postby stephent » Sun Jul 24, 2016 11:27 pm

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Well, it don't look like this now. Roof is off, sides are starting to be ripped off. The old 120ac-12vdc converter is out (saved). The 35 ft of 50 amp 120volt cord is out (saved). The fridge turned out to be a replacement plain icebox (I have the original Jayco buildsheet and info sheets that came with it.) :) The 4 burner stovetop/oven is probably history...lots of rust, bad oven door hinge. The 120 volt 5,500 btu room air conditioner still works and is out. Both slide-outs are removed as is their slides. Those heavy duty bed slide/guides look like something I could use in the galley for a slide-out table or cooler support. 8) I have been eyeballing the top tie-down buckles. They look like something to use on the bottom of the hatch since 2 of them can have a paddle-lock thru them for security..

But had to stop just after noonish cuz of 98 degrees in the shade and 118 heat index. By the time the temp dropped down to almost human.... it started storming. More lightening then needed or wanted. Lightnin cooked about a couple of dozen fuse links from here to Jericho and took the linemen over 4 hours replacing them to get as far as my road.. I thanked them profusely!!
Sometime in the next few days I need to find someone to help me bolt the trailer hitch under the ol Impala..supposedly 40 minutes for one man. Looks like that could be using a vehicle lift....laying under the car on the ground and trying to pick up a 30 pound hunk of steel with your arms stretched above your head (flat above) is harder to do then most think. Install info looks straight forward for sure. All bolt-on with no welding..
It's progress of a sort..
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Re: New start.

Postby stephent » Mon Jul 25, 2016 7:17 pm

Well, it kinda looks like there was a 'splosion...or a tornado?
But it's getting there ***slowly*** cuz of this heat and humidity. And myriad of other stuff I have to do around here.
But slow and sure progress could prevent me from making so many boo-boos...
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Re: New start.

Postby stephent » Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:42 am

Well...here I am again. This demo seems slow going to me. Probably the temp and heat index of over 110 every day by noon, but it could be I'm slow and old too. But I will get there.
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Re: New start.

Postby stephent » Thu Jul 28, 2016 10:28 am

Got the deck stripped down to bare frame. Seems I have 3 good jacks under it with the right back one torn off.. got to reposition 2 of them anyway at the back, and don't need one in front.
First pic is bare frame......second pic is planned after cutting/welding.
The light blue lines will be the frame left after a bit of cutting. The green lines will be added 2"x2"x1/8" angle. I don't like the area of the joint at the front of the A tongue meeting the frame so I will add a bit.
Won't take much I figure, could reuse some of the steel I am cutting off I guess too..
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Re: New start.

Postby KCStudly » Thu Jul 28, 2016 1:08 pm

The green diagonal 'K' members, or "kickers" will actually add stress points without adding much strength. Triangulation works better when the connections occurr at corners, not mid-span. Just saying.
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Re: New start.

Postby stephent » Thu Jul 28, 2016 3:48 pm

ok...thanks KCStudly. Then I will do 4 of the shorter ...and maybe well shorter?... front green angles spanning just the hinky dog-leg tongue/frame connections. Or something entirely else. Needs more strength in the corner area after removal of outrigger steel.
I'm just wondering about the strength of the stock frame in this area since the outer overhanging the wheel width areas (outrigger part of frame) will be cut off. The frame is 3 3/4" x 1 5/8" x 1/16" C channel ...Suggestions?

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Re: New start.

Postby KCStudly » Thu Jul 28, 2016 8:21 pm

What you will be left with is definitely not how I would design from scratch, but I think you will be okay w/o having to add a whole bunch of steel back.

I would definitely cap the cut ends of the C's and maybe even fit vertical stiffeners into the inside were the toes (tips) of the long pieces join at the xmbrs. This will tie the long pieces together better. Then I would put a full width xmbr at or just behind the new corner of the 'A'-frame to long rail joints.

And that should pretty much do it. The vertical stiffeners and caps are the key things here judging by how the channels appear to cross one another. Can you get a better close up shot looking at the inside of that dog leg? Try to show which member is cut and welded to the other, and which one is whole.
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Re: New start.

Postby stephent » Thu Jul 28, 2016 9:59 pm

The A tongue frame piece goes thru the front crossmember and across the inside frame to the outside of the added outrigger piece..it's one piece...welded to the inside frame piece at a 45 deg but ONLY on the small ends of the C not across the long back side of the C..that's the sucky part. I thought of a way to get it all shortened up 18" and much stronger and a square angle corner instead of the dog leg angle.. Frame is about 18" longer then I need anyway in front of the tires. Same in rear too. It's also about 150 pds weight more then I want as well. Cutting the outrigger metal off..removing the hydraulic brakes, drums, etc Getting a plain ol 2" ball hitch installed and removing over 18" off the back behind the axle and cutting out 18" of the frame behind the tongue should make me happier with the weight.
Plating the inside of the C channel would work very well, but leaves the frame 18" too long in front still. My portaband/sawzall and sidegrinder and my wire welder will fix that problem.
If I had gone the HF trailer route I was going to weld it all up anyway.
I've decided to keep the torsion axle. There seems to be plenty of folks reporting they fail....but only those ones made in Mexico since 2003-4 and on boat trailers at that have had "failures" as in dropping and rubbing fenders suddenly (only 3-4 and not Dexter)...the ones reported as failed just sagged a bit but they keep going for decades anyway. Only one ever reported as having the arm slide out of the suspension rubber...again not Dexter. I think the warning of 20-25 years is some CMA lawyer talk to cover the companies tails. This one seems to not have sagged much at all. But it's never been hauled far...and usually on good roads. It's just set for 98% of it's life. If it gives me trouble...I have a trailer supply place with a 1500 pd axle and springs that's 6 miles away that wants about $150 for everything to change it over to a leaf axle...brand r new.
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Re: New start.

Postby stephent » Fri Jul 29, 2016 8:54 pm

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I cut 18" out of the siderail C-sections....it needs 4" more off to be a square 52"x8' frame... but that factory plated sections are 3/32" plus the 1/16" C channel and tuff to cut...I might still...or just leave it cuz I want a front box anyway for extras..
I could add a couple of 2"x2" angles across the corners, but don't think they would be needed????
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Re: New start.

Postby KCStudly » Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:24 pm

:thinking: I'm not seeing much for welds there. Are they just hidden by the rust and crud, or have you refit it all and just not welded it back together yet? If the later it should be pretty good once you weld it up.
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Re: New start.

Postby Philip » Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:35 pm

KCStudly wrote::thinking: I'm not seeing much for welds there. Are they just hidden by the rust and crud, or have you refit it all and just not welded it back together yet? If the later it should be pretty good once you weld it up.


There is not much weld on them from the factory. I have converted a couple to flat decks. I did a lot of welding the factory didn't.
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