#4

...ask your questions in the appropriate forums BUT document your build here...preferably in a single thread...dates for updates, are appreciated....

Re: #4

Postby Atomic77 » Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:59 am

tony.latham wrote:
On my bucket list, how to do epoxy.


It's simple. No mystery. No chanting. No black candles.

T
Yep. Pretty straight forward

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Re: #4

Postby tony.latham » Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:03 pm

This boy showed up today. I was going to hold off but the CamelCamelCamel website told me that Amazon's price had come down from $200 to $170. If you go look... it's back up to $200.

It's a Renogy 100 watt flexible ETFE panel.

Image

Image

I dithered long and hard over solar. The flexible PET panels ––which are what most of flex-panels are made from-- are world-famous for failing. So they were out and I was back to a glass panel. And then I found these. ETFE panels are much better but about double the cost. There thin (1/8"?) and much lighter than glass panels.

Here's Renogy's guarantee: 25-year power output warranty: 5 year/95% efficiency rate, 10 year/90% efficiency rate, 25-year/80% efficiency rate. 5-Year material and workmanship warranty.

:thumbsup:

T
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Re: #4

Postby Tom&Shelly » Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:39 pm

tony.latham wrote:A cut and paste from http://www.Sentryair.com

Epoxy Exposure Respiratory Harm
When epoxy fumes are inhaled, they can affect the nose, throat, and lungs. Most symptoms from the inhalation of epoxy involve inflammation and therefore irritation of the nose, throat, and lungs. Repetitive and high amounts of exposure to these fumes can result in sensitization and asthma.

When the dust from partially cured epoxy is inhaled, the particles become trapped in the mucus lining of the respiratory system and can cause serious health problems. According to West System, a leading epoxy manufacturer, this dust should never be inhaled. [Ref. 2]

Epoxy Sensitization and Asthma
Sensitization, in this case, is the state of being allergic to epoxy. Sensitization can occur at any point, regardless of how many times or for how long you’ve been exposed to epoxy. Your chances of being sensitized will increase if you’re exposed to a greater amount of fumes in an unventilated area, but even one episode of exposure can lead to an allergic reaction. This is why preventative safety is so important in regard to epoxy. Once sensitized, even small amounts of the substance can trigger allergic reactions and it will be increasingly difficult to work with the material. There is also no definite cure for sensitization, only methods to relieve the symptoms.


From West Systems: Exposure by inhaling vapors is unlikely because epoxy products evaporate slowly. However, the risk increases when ventilation is inadequate or when the products are heated.

I don't use this stuff on a daily basis --certainly not repetitively. When I do, I open up the windows and garage door. During sanding, I wear a respirator.

We definitely need to be conscious beyond our fingers when it comes to shop safety.

'Nuff said. :frightened:

Tony


Back when we were talking epoxy and fiberglass a year ago on Shelly's and my teardrop build folder, Todd suggested these masks: https://www.homedepot.com/p/3M-Medium-H ... /202080143. We bought a pair, and they are good. We use them when spraying paint and when dry sanding epoxy and/or fiberglass. Of course, even the best masks aren't especially comfortable.

Now for my confessions:

I'd never recommend this to anyone, particularly with experiences like Michael's to counter any good arguments (and we don't really have any), but we never wore the masks while spreading epoxy. We read the West Systems warnings that you posted Tony, and decided we have adequate ventilation.

Now, epoxy dust and fiber glass dust just can't be good. From what I've read, they can get into your lungs and essentially never leave. (I believe it is the cured epoxy they are talking about when referring to the sensitivity.) And fiber glass is, well, glass, and the particles can have sharp edges. However, I found most of the time, I only needed to wet sand the epoxy (by hand--no power sanding devices) and felt I didn't need the mask for that. Again, I'd never recommend that to anyone else.

I also mostly hand sand wood. When using a power sander, we do it outside when possible, or at least open our opposing garage doors to let the wind carry the finer dust away. The cancer risk due to saw dust that the State of California warns about on every piece of wood sold west of the Mississippi (or so it seems) were from studies of workers at furniture factories and saw mills, where they breathed it every day of their working lives. So we take a bit of a chance. But, again, I wouldn't suggest that for anyone else.

Not great excuses! Even sounds a little embarrassing as I write them out. :thinking:

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Re: #4

Postby Tom&Shelly » Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:43 pm

tony.latham wrote:I know some of you must be lying awake wondering where I've been. Wondering if I fell off a cliff or threw my carcass onto my Sawstop (which wouldn't make a mess).

We did a one-nighter in Flash last week. Took a poke around some old stomping grounds. Here's a shot of the Big Lost River Range. It's steep.

Image

Tony


Beautiful! :applause:

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Re: #4

Postby Louisd75 » Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:21 am

tony.latham wrote:This boy showed up today. I was going to hold off but the CamelCamelCamel website told me that Amazon's price had come down from $200 to $170. If you go look... it's back up to $200.

It's a Renogy 100 watt flexible ETFE panel.

Image

Image

I dithered long and hard over solar. The flexible PET panels ––which are what most of flex-panels are made from-- are world-famous for failing. So they were out and I was back to a glass panel. And then I found these. ETFE panels are much better but about double the cost. There thin (1/8"?) and much lighter than glass panels.

Here's Renogy's guarantee: 25-year power output warranty: 5 year/95% efficiency rate, 10 year/90% efficiency rate, 25-year/80% efficiency rate. 5-Year material and workmanship warranty.

:thumbsup:

T

Dang it Tony! I've been thinking about solar and how I could run the wiring and now you've gotta post this. It probably won't happen before our big summer trip, but now you've got me thinking about how I can expand my little electrical cubby for a controller display.

Also, a bit late, but I really like the MSA 3000 series of full face respirators. They're not inexpensive, but it's handy being able to change from one cartridge to the next depending on what I'm doing, and the polycarbonate face shield protects almost as much as a separate face shield. It also goes on like a baseball catcher's mask, you've just gotta loosen or tighten the straps, but they're easy to do once you've done it a couple times. They're not as much fun to use in hot weather, but it's not usually very hot in my corner of the country.
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Re: #4

Postby tony.latham » Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:06 pm

Dang it Tony! I've been thinking about solar and how I could run the wiring and now you've gotta post this.


Yep. I've got about six inches between my upper rear bulkhead and the hatch spar. I'll go through the roof with a couple of cable glands and the controller will be on the galley side of the bulkhead.

I'm trying to work out my propane plumbing. Since I'm using a Partner stove, I need two regulators since the stoves takes 27 PSI and the Propex needs the 11" WC.

My propane-installation friend about freaked when I told him 27 PSI. That's way out of his box.

What I decided to do was to tee it off under the floor and add the Propex regulator to the tee.

Tony
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Re: #4

Postby tony.latham » Fri Jun 21, 2019 8:56 pm

Doors. I keep flashing back to installing factory doors. So much easier...

Anywho, I cranked out a jig today to ensure the hinges were set in the door nice and square.

Image

Once I had them in the jig, I took the part off that mimicked the door and temporarily screwed them to the door.

Image

With the door in the opening –-and shimmed up-- it was an easy thing to screw the hinges to the wall.

Image

It's funny how little teardrop things are such big things. Having a door hinged in a wall is kinda like saying goodnight to your first date at her door. After the kiss. :?


I'll be using #10 machine screws and T-nuts for the hinges. I dithered about how I was going to deal with these. The nuts in the wall will be countersunk and covered with the door trim, so that wasn't the issue. It was finding the nuts inside the door. Hidden behind the glassed-over exterior skin. :NC What the???

But here's what I dithered up for the hidden door T-nuts:

1. The door has the exterior skin attached to the core --the interior skin is yet to be applied.
2. The hinges are temporarily mounted with wood screws to mark the holes.
3. The back of the door is milled out for the T-nuts using a Forstner bit. 1/4" Holes are bored through to the outside. The nuts are not installed.
4. I can now glass the exterior without worrying about gooping up the threads in the T-nuts with epoxy.
5. Once glassed, I can install the T-nuts and the interior sheathing.
6. It'll be an easy thing to see where the holes are under the cured fiberglass.

:thumbsup: :thumbsup:

$800 factory doors, who needs them? :frightened:

Tony
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Re: #4

Postby tony.latham » Sun Jun 23, 2019 1:45 pm

It's a poly day.

Image

One wall is finished. I may be able to start on the floor this afternoon. :FNP

T
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Re: #4

Postby Tom&Shelly » Sun Jun 23, 2019 2:30 pm

tony.latham wrote:It's a poly day.

Image

One wall is finished. I may be able to start on the floor this afternoon. :FNP

T


Not sure I could go that fast even if I knew what I was doing!

Good job! :thumbsup:

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Re: #4

Postby tony.latham » Sun Jun 23, 2019 7:15 pm

I got the floor framed out this afternoon and joined with temporary gussets.

Image

The skinny cross members are made from 3/4" plywood set on edge for stiffness. The plywood is to support the galley bulkhead, battery, water jug and blocking for the heater. The 1 x 4" towards the front is for headboard support.

It'll be sheathed with 1/4" plywood, top and bottom and the voids filled with foam board.

:thinking:

Tony
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Re: #4

Postby tony.latham » Mon Jun 24, 2019 9:05 pm

I got the foam board in the floor and the sheathing on. I hesitate to call it insulation since its primary purpose, is to add stiffness between the two layers of 1/4" subfloor ply. But it is insulated.

The floor is stiff and I'm glad I didn't go with anything thicker.

Here's the base that I'll build on. I dithered on whether to use rollers as in the last two builds but the only time I'll move this beast is when I'm ready to load it on the chassis. For that, I added some slick plastic on the bottom runners. I'll only have to move it a few feet.

Image

It's 19" tall. The same as my chassis. In the past, I've gone with a dolly that is about 7" high and that's too low. I'm going to toy with cutting this down a few inches.

Here's the bottom of the floor slathered up with epoxy:

Image

No black goo from the La Brea Tar Pits. :shock:

:thumbsup:

Tony
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Re: #4

Postby noseoil » Tue Jun 25, 2019 8:01 am

I used Henry's white roof coating for the bottom on my build. Scuff sand first (urethane under mine on 1/8" BB ply skin), then roll on 2 coats & that's it. Nice thing about it is if you have to go underneath it to work at a later date, it's always light under there & easy to see stuff since it's so bright.

No problems so far after about 5 years & 20K miles, so I'm calling it good. It's softer than an epoxy or urethane, but stays flexible & takes gravel roads, dirt & road grime easily. I just spray it at the car wash once in a while to clean things & it's good as new. Used regular foam membrane between the frame rails & bottom panel, like you would on a framed wall for a house. Soft cushion until the bolts are torqued & things are in place, then it's solid & stiff with the frame & body fastened down.
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Re: #4

Postby tony.latham » Tue Jun 25, 2019 10:25 am

noseoil wrote:I used Henry's white roof coating for the bottom on my build. Scuff sand first (urethane under mine on 1/8" BB ply skin), then roll on 2 coats & that's it. Nice thing about it is if you have to go underneath it to work at a later date, it's always light under there & easy to see stuff since it's so bright.

No problems so far after about 5 years & 20K miles, so I'm calling it good. It's softer than an epoxy or urethane, but stays flexible & takes gravel roads, dirt & road grime easily. I just spray it at the car wash once in a while to clean things & it's good as new. Used regular foam membrane between the frame rails & bottom panel, like you would on a framed wall for a house. Soft cushion until the bolts are torqued & things are in place, then it's solid & stiff with the frame & body fastened down.


:thumbsup:
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Re: #4

Postby tony.latham » Wed Jun 26, 2019 9:47 pm

The bottom of the floor is sealed and it's flipped right-side-up with the first coat of poly on it.

Image

I'm close to turning a big corner. Erecting a wall. I still need two more coats of poly on the interior of the floor.

Two walls up and I will not know what to do with all the shop space. :frightened:

:worship:

Tony
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Re: #4

Postby tony.latham » Sat Jun 29, 2019 2:31 pm

Dry fitting the first wall.

It was killing me to make sure I had 3/8" of a gap (for the seal) where the hatch will mate with the backside of the floor. It's within a 16". Since that surface will get two coats of epoxy, it should be fine. But maybe I'll run a piece of fiberglass across it too.

Image

It's not getting attached today because I decided two coats of poly on the floor wasn't enough. Maybe tonight. Tomorrow for sure.

It'll be good to free up bench space so I can start on the innards. Rear bulkheads, hatch spar, headboard bulkheads, and the like.
I find those parts kinda frustrating because they need at least two coats of poly, top and bottom and it needs to be done prior to installation. Watching paint (or varnish) dry doesn't keep my blood flowing. And those parts need to be done before I can mount the other wall.

:thinking:

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