Baby canned ham design

Canned Hams of all types and sizes...and Bread Boxes to go with that ham......

Postby PKCSPT » Tue Jan 04, 2011 11:21 am

For me I think you hit the floorplan perfect.
Would be room for me and one young grandchild, if it is raining just enough room to sit and play cards, read or draw. Small enough to handle by myself and get into all the little back places I prefer to go.

Now to convince my husband I need a new camper,, hmmm
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Postby bbarry » Wed Jan 05, 2011 11:21 pm

angib wrote:
There are two 'bumps' above the floor at the front and back. These are my preferred way of supporting the overhanging body without going the more popular method of throwing lots of heavy framing under the floor - these are two 1x6 boards on edge sitting on top of the HF frame and holding up the sidewalls. 1x4 might be enough, I'm not sure. Either has the problem that they will create a 'nook and cranny' behind which things will get dropped and lost!


There is a bit of Steve Wolverton's Puffin mixed into the design as well - I propose to use his single skin with insulation and fabric covering technique for the sidewalls.


Andrew, this has a lot of potential to be very attractive to a number of people looking for "just a little more" than a teardrop, or standing room to change in, which is what my wife likes about the idea.

What are your thoughts about building something of this nature on an appropriately sized version of your ultralight frame? With the weight savings from the frame, it seems doable at first glance. Do you see the dropped floor and A frame tongue as insurmountable obstacles?

Do I understand you correctly to say that your "bumps" are transverse members, acting as miniature bulkheads and carrying some of the sidewall load across the floor? If so, these "bumps" on a stressed skin floor panel would seem a good place to start for a self supporting body. The interior framing for the front cabinet and the bed would seem to fill much the same role however, if tied into the sidewall.

Can you elaborate on the fabric covered sidewalls you referred to? I don't remember Steve using that method on the Puffin and I can't see the pics on that thread any longer.

Thanks for posting this, it has me considering build #2!
Brad

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Postby angib » Thu Jan 06, 2011 5:49 am

Making a 'wheels-in' self-supporting body looks impossibly hard to me. What allows the ultralight (and any 'wheels-out' teardrop) to be self-supporting is that the axle brackets sit directly under the sidewalls so that all the weight of the body is transferred straight to the axle brackets. With a 'wheels-in' trailer that can't be done and so the problem is that axle just wants to push up through the floor.

So I think some sort of chassis is going to be needed, in which case the HF trailer is cheap and simple, even if it isn't perfect.

I should perhaps also do a version of the Wanderer with a custom chassis for those who like welding, as it would be better than the HF version.
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Postby bbarry » Thu Jan 06, 2011 10:30 pm

I understand your concern about the axle force not acting directly on the sidewall and the wall instead being cantilevered out over the axle attachment point. That being said, I'd be surprised to find it impossible to do if the body is braced appropriately and the shape of the frame changed some to accommodate the dropped floor.

I'm traveling right now and only have my iPad or I'd attach a drawing of what I'd envision. Keep in mind that when you clip your fingernails, you lose more engineering experience than I have in my entire life.

My first build also has a cantilevered floor and sidewall attachment and I haven't had trouble with that yet. It's just 3/4 ply floor extended 6" beyond the frame and a 2x2 nailer screwed around the outside to attach the sidewall to. There are two bulkheads that are a structural part of the body that carry some of the load transversely across the frame and save the plywood floor from carrying the entire body. For a frame of reference, my first build was a fairly heavy 5x9.5' with a dry weight of 1020lbs.

In a small, light trailer like the Wanderer, it would seem like a more structurally sound floor along with structural bulkheads like the cabinet face and bed/dinette frame would achieve a similar result. Think of the bulkheads as transverse frames, just above the floor instead of below.

Perhaps I'm thinking of this all wrong, I dunno. Or, maybe it's not worth the trouble.
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Postby angib » Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:42 am

bbarry wrote:My first build also has a cantilevered floor and sidewall attachment and I haven't had trouble with that yet. It's just 3/4 ply floor extended 6" beyond the frame and a 2x2 nailer screwed around the outside to attach the sidewall to. There are two bulkheads that are a structural part of the body that carry some of the load transversely across the frame and save the plywood floor from carrying the entire body.

That sounds to me like there is a complete frame under the body - which is not a self-supporting body.

The task is to take the point loads from the axle mounts (leaf spring or torsion) and carry those to the sidewalls, which carry most of the trailer weight. And you can't have a cross-member, becasue the wheels are in the way.

So you end up with something very like a normal trailer frame with two longitudinal main rails, a tongue or A-frame in front, and two or more cross-members. That's a lot more than an ultralight chassis.
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Postby bbarry » Fri Jan 07, 2011 7:26 pm

Sorry, I appear to be hijacking your thread a bit.

You are correct: there is a full frame under my first build, I was drawing a parallel as my axle force also enters the body inboard of the sidewalls (just spread much more due to the full frame).

I wasn't very clear, the bulkheads I was talking about were not chassis frame members, they were integral parts of the body. Below you can see the rear bulkhead and there is another at the head of the sleeping area.

Image

Similar structural features (not full height) might allow for a minimalist frame, but I can see why it should be at least somewhat different than the ultralight. If you do end up designing a custom chassis, I'll be curious to see what you think would be best.

Thanks again for posting this design, it sparks the imagination!
Brad

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Postby angib » Sat Jan 08, 2011 7:04 am

Ah - you want a real frameless trailer body! Yes, that is no problem, but in something like the Wanderer it takes quite a lot of layout compromises to get the 'dwarf bulkheads' in place - or else the floor has to be 12" or so above the underside of the trailer which is equally inconvenient.

You definitely want to have a look at this all-plywood-structure racecar transporter - OK, he added a bit of carbon fibre on the tongue, but I'm not even sure that was needed.

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Postby steve smoot » Sat Jan 08, 2011 8:11 am

Andrew, have you ever thought about publishing a book of trailer plans and construction details :thinking: I would buy a copy
I am not a complete idiot, some parts are missing...
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Postby angib » Sat Jan 08, 2011 10:58 am

Actually, I did get 75% of the way through doing a set of plans for soemone to sell in the US. The idea was that you would get a full-scale paper CAD sidewall template:

Image

And then a complete set of step-by-step plans to build a Cub/Modernistic, like this draft section on the bulkhead:

Image

But it never got finished, which didn't disappoint me as I never was happy with the idea of selling plans for which I hadn't first built a prototype.
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Postby bbarry » Tue Jan 11, 2011 8:40 pm

angib wrote:Ah - you want a real frameless trailer body! Yes, that is no problem, but in something like the Wanderer it takes quite a lot of layout compromises to get the 'dwarf bulkheads' in place - or else the floor has to be 12" or so above the underside of the trailer which is equally inconvenient.


That link is definitely cool, maybe a bit more extreme than I had in mind. :) With at least some chassis under our version, you wouldn't need the full monty (monte?) of the frameless frame he has though. I'm thinking a torsion box (yes, torsion has little to do with it) floor with a lattice of maybe 1.5" members skinned on either side. The dinette framing, cabinetry, etc., (anything that is screwed or doweled to the sidewall) would act to transfer sidewall load transversely across the floor. Admittedly, I have a slightly different floor plan in mind, but I think it might work on a "minimal" frame, maybe not completely frameless.

On the other hand, a more conventional approach wouldn't really make a porker out your baby ham. Ha! :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Postby gullywompr » Sun Mar 13, 2011 9:20 pm

mikeschn wrote:Andrew,

If you send me the model, I can do up a rendering for you.

Mike...


If you guys have time, I'd really enjoy seeing a rendering.
Cheers,
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Postby Kim Armstrong » Tue Jun 07, 2011 8:11 pm

Andrew, Have you got any drawings on a Wanderer on a HF big enough for a queen size bed turned lengthwise that makes into a dinette, toilet/shower and galley? Thanks
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Postby angib » Thu Jun 09, 2011 11:19 am

Kim Armstrong wrote:Andrew, Have you got any drawings on a Wanderer on a HF big enough for a queen size bed turned lengthwise that makes into a dinette, toilet/shower and galley? Thanks

When I ever get round to finishing them, the Wanderer plans will have 8' and 10' versions - it's so easy to make a 10 foot version that it seems silly not to. One has a queen size dinette but it runs across the width.

However the way you slipped in that word shower suggest that you think this design is bigger than it is - there is just standing headroom (about 72") in the dropped footwell in the middle of the trailer. You can put a shower there, though then you cannot get in or out of the trailer except through the shower.

Thee is no way you can build a smaller full-size trailer on a HF trailer - it can only be a tiny trailer.
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Postby Kim Armstrong » Fri Jun 10, 2011 5:46 pm

I guess what I was thinking about doing was this profile built as a 6x10 or 11 ft. with a sit down shower. I know it's not going to be a tiny trailer but it would still fit on a HF trailer. Looking forward to seeing your plans. Thanks
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