Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby Bluebunny » Mon Jan 11, 2016 12:52 am

OP827 wrote:Looks great! Cannot wait to see the finished model! My next build will start with first completely finished scaled model too. I learned my lesson now.
What do you plan for lift assist?


The finished upper clam is expected to weigh 380 lbs. With the front on a hinge, I expect a rear-lift force of 225 lb to get it to move.

I am hopeful for something manual and simple. Two 150 lb gas springs situated at about 2/3 back from the hinge would be sweet, but I'll really have to search to find the correct pair within my budget. My fall-back is a lifting winch and cable, not unlike the pulling winches found on boat trailers. (NEVER EVER lift with a pulling winch!)
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby OP827 » Mon Jan 11, 2016 12:46 pm

380lbs for 1/4" thick ply upper clam of your size sounds heavy for me. Should be somewhere roughly 150lbs range.
My foldable foam trailer build: http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=61344
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby Bluebunny » Mon Jan 11, 2016 1:26 pm

OP827 wrote:380lbs for 1/4" thick ply upper clam of your size sounds heavy for me. Should be somewhere roughly 150lbs range.


Hi OP,
Yes, I believe you are correct; 380 lbs seems heavy. I generally use a rule-of-thumb 40lbs per 1/4" sheet construction for a fully fitted/painted/doored/applianced/wired monster. Some could say use 30, which is possible... The upper clam uses six sheets of 1/4" ply, plus one sheet of 3/8" for the aft bulkheads, and a small 5/8" front bulkhead. Almost no framing except the heavy duty gunnels and a few gussets. It will have a vent fan mounted and some minor lighting. 3/4" foam over ply (top surface only), with cloth and fabric, painted skin.

Secretly, I hope for about 270 lbs for the top clam, but how many people come in at or under their weight budget? - near none! I am committed to keep my total dry weight at 900 lbs; giving this sized trailer an "ultra-light" status.

(reference total sheet material list: 6 @ 1/4" <shells>, 3 @ 5/8" <floor and bulkheads>, and 1 @ 3/8" <rear walls>)
off topic Stitch-and-Glue ply kayak build... https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set ... 254&type=3
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby greygoos » Mon Jan 11, 2016 4:01 pm

poptopper.jpg
poptopper.jpg (30.56 KiB) Viewed 1482 times
Thinking along the same lines for my truck. Came across this at youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmwnBPr7N5A and this pic of a fold up tear? would like to so a combination of both
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby Bluebunny » Mon Jan 11, 2016 6:37 pm

Those are all awesome! For my planned travels through the jungles of urban America, I want the illusion of walls, so have decided cloth walls are out. The smaller pickup camper has the solid side inserts... :thumbsup:
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby greygoos » Mon Jan 11, 2016 6:42 pm

I should have explained. I will be using a solid wall that folds.
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby Bluebunny » Mon Jan 11, 2016 6:46 pm

greygoos wrote:I should have explained. I will be using a solid wall that folds.


Greygoos,
We would love for you to share your vision for the pickup camper! I have always loved pickup campers for the ultimate in mobility and ease of travel - in comfort!
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby greygoos » Mon Jan 11, 2016 7:07 pm

Still working on the design, not sure what materials will be used, started as a foamie or hybrid foamie but keep changing the plan. Will post soon.
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby Bluebunny » Mon Jan 11, 2016 7:12 pm

greygoos wrote:Still working on the design, not sure what materials will be used, started as a foamie or hybrid foamie but keep changing the plan. Will post soon.


I threw my ideas out here rather early, and the good folks here were supportive, and really helped my ideas get better! Good Luck and Happy Journey!
off topic Stitch-and-Glue ply kayak build... https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set ... 254&type=3
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby OP827 » Wed Jan 13, 2016 11:01 am

Bluebunny wrote:
OP827 wrote:380lbs for 1/4" thick ply upper clam of your size sounds heavy for me. Should be somewhere roughly 150lbs range.


Hi OP,
Yes, I believe you are correct; 380 lbs seems heavy. I generally use a rule-of-thumb 40lbs per 1/4" sheet construction for a fully fitted/painted/doored/applianced/wired monster. Some could say use 30, which is possible... The upper clam uses six sheets of 1/4" ply, plus one sheet of 3/8" for the aft bulkheads, and a small 5/8" front bulkhead. Almost no framing except the heavy duty gunnels and a few gussets. It will have a vent fan mounted and some minor lighting. 3/4" foam over ply (top surface only), with cloth and fabric, painted skin.

Secretly, I hope for about 270 lbs for the top clam, but how many people come in at or under their weight budget? - near none! I am committed to keep my total dry weight at 900 lbs; giving this sized trailer an "ultra-light" status.

(reference total sheet material list: 6 @ 1/4" <shells>, 3 @ 5/8" <floor and bulkheads>, and 1 @ 3/8" <rear walls>)


Hi Bluebunny,
I did not know that you were also adding foam and fabric to 1/4" ply. What is your wall sandwich structure design. If you make 3/4" foam and fabric part of your structure, i.e. it is glued, you could potentially switch to lighter 1/8" plywood. I have 1/8" Baltic birch ply on inside for some of my free standing walls and they feel rigid and strong together with foam in a sandwich structure. Just thinking out loud here.
My foldable foam trailer build: http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=61344
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby Bluebunny » Wed Jan 13, 2016 10:18 pm

OP827 wrote:
Hi Bluebunny,
I did not know that you were also adding foam and fabric to 1/4" ply. What is your wall sandwich structure design. If you make 3/4" foam and fabric part of your structure, i.e. it is glued, you could potentially switch to lighter 1/8" plywood. I have 1/8" Baltic birch ply on inside for some of my free standing walls and they feel rigid and strong together with foam in a sandwich structure. Just thinking out loud here.


The roof plan is 1/4" ply under 3/4" foam. Thin foam is not very structural, so keeping with the original shell thickness. I know ply, and am niether experienced nor confident in my ability to achieve a strong foam structure. (remember) "When you think like a hammer, everything has to work like a nail". So wood plies are my structural elements.

The walls will be simply painted plywood with no insulation. The whole kaboodle is somewhat of an experiment on many levels...like creativity! fun! Science! and (hopefully) adventure! :vroom:
off topic Stitch-and-Glue ply kayak build... https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set ... 254&type=3
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby Bluebunny » Sat Jan 16, 2016 5:36 pm

Hi Folks,
I've been in-and-out of town, and like allyall, life gets interesting and slows progress. Just a quick update to show some scale model update. The thing is very unfinished and rough, but gets the shape and simpler concepts shown. I believe building this model will help me with the real-build; sequencing the assembly, challenges in fit and handling, and more...

Assembling the monstrous 5 ft x 14 ft roof and side panels modeled better than expected. One or two forms should be enough to pull it together.

138869138870138871

After some rough stitch-and-glue construction, the rough model form is shown below. The top clam upper front bulkhead has not been fitted.


138874138872

138875138873

One rather large, unresolved challenge will be to invert, lift, and fit the big top clam shell once assembled! Getting fit and function and weather sealing looks to be about like I expected; very do-able...
off topic Stitch-and-Glue ply kayak build... https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set ... 254&type=3
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby OP827 » Fri Feb 12, 2016 2:05 pm

Your concept is great and it should work. Check this recent video out, for fun - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnWOynlBHfg, but I do not like that their side door does not fit well and no thermal insulation will cause condensation.
My foldable foam trailer build: http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=61344
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby rowerwet » Wed Feb 17, 2016 6:17 pm

Actually, I talked to John Harris on his blog, the first one built has foam insulation on the inside, I also mentioned that the galley is tiny, and the overall size is smaller than what most find they prefer.
John said those issues will be addressed on newer designs down the road.
The kit will run about $1,500, which seems like a lot of money for a tiny 4x8.
Last edited by rowerwet on Fri Feb 19, 2016 8:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Standing clam-shell mousetrip sleeper

Postby OP827 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 1:31 am

If the kit is only for cnc cut plywood then it seems as a lot of money, agreed.
My foldable foam trailer build: http://www.tnttt.com/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=61344
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